...mostly because Apple's copy protection keeps you from burning any purchased song onto more than seven CDs.

Not necessarily. The DRM prevents you from burning more than seven CDs with exactly the same songs in exactly the same order. But, why would you want to? Make a master, and dupe it to your hearts content.

How is the RIAA not a cartel?

Geez, you'd think they'd see the obvious benefits of reducing their distribution costs so significantly. Selling ones and zeros through the ether, without having to deal with a myriad of retailers and the hassle of actually moving a physical object from point A to point B would seem to be fairly obvious, along with Stephen's point of 99 cents being a purely painless impulse buy that doesn't engender any hesitation on the part of the consumer.

These idiots don't grasp how the world is working in their favor, as much as it now works against the interests of other industries. Think for a minute about the newspaper industry. I used to easily spend seven to ten bucks a week on newspapers, but now I get that content for a fraction of twenty bucks a month. The point is that I had no inhibition against spending a dollar a day for newspapers, whereas I haven't spent more than $50 dollars a year on recorded music since I finished switching from vinyl a long time ago.

I have been considering getting some type of device for some time, and the 99 cent/song price point is what is attractive to me, along with the portability, of course (saw a commercial for a 1000 song ipod last night that looked to be about the size of a credit card; cool!), so I am on the verge of giving Apple a pretty good stream of income if they don't succeed in making it less attractive to me.

I can't be that unusual.

Feh. I still mourn for the days of album cover art, and colored vinyl. Nothing like having the White Album on white vinyl, the Red Ablum on red vinyl, and I'm still searching for the Blue on blue vinyl.

Meh, who needs an iPod when there's XM.

I am still an Apple Atheist. I refuse to suppor them, because I will not tolerate copy restrictions, and I don't want to support anyone who supports them. Also, I typically want to KNOW what the compression level is.

Currently is use an old model archos that I was able to put an 80 gig drive in so I could have all my music all the time at 250-300 kibts.

I am not happy with Apple winning the market. Yes the ipods are sexy, but I want a device that looks like a windows directory and does not try to advance copy protection in any way.

If they get an 80-gig Ipod under $100 bucks some day, I may have to compromise my principles.

doug

Jeez, Doug, is this an extension of a hostility rooted in life-long thralldom to Wm. Gates, or what? I didn't know tin-foil could so effectively constrict cranial circulation.

For my own part, I have not succumbed to the charms of iPod, but I confess to a major addiction to my G5 with five continuous days worth of music I can let play while I work. Sometimes during a particularly processor-intensive 3D animation render, or DVD burn, the system chokes, and I have to forego the music for a while.

That's when I think the iPod might be a solution.

But I'm holding out for a subcutaneous implant.

The DRM prevents you from burning more than seven CDs with exactly the same songs in exactly the same order. But, why would you want to? Make a master, and dupe it to your hearts content.

Or, you can just strip the DRM out. There are ways.

I don't do iTunes. Hate the format isues. I bought an iRiver a while ago and have been downloading off MSN. Same prices...terrible search functions.

But, hey, we are about the same generation. I found the coolest new band that rocks the headphones off; Bowling For Soup. Give them a download. These guys re-made A Flock of Seagulls hit, I Ran (So Far Away). Now, everyone today is remaking songs...but, these guys actually did it BETTER than the original, I think.
As you said...I am an old guy getting hip again, because I can surf, sample and decide what I want to buy.

For new music I still prefer to buy the CD (to avoid the compression), but I have been buying a lot of classic single tracks too.

Also, the weekly free tracks are really interesting sometimes.

I find myself alternately either being just a couple tracks from an artist (even one I love) or bying more than the contents of a CD from a single artist - but if I tried to buy the CDs, I'd be buying about 10 of them to get all those songs, even though each of them would be on more than one CD with more than one of the other songs.

I like Windows 2000 (I hate XP and shudder in horror at Longhorn, but I also don't really care for Macs)...

but I fscking LOVE iTunes. Except for that Bonjour thingie, which as soon as I was sure it wouldn't destroy my program, I locked out of doing anything.

Something I find amusing (in a head-shaking sort of way) is how all the tech press insists over and over that using an iPod "locks you in" to the iTMS. Uh, no, guys-- you can always buy CDs or download MP3s. They always worked and always will.

But those who rail against the iTMS' DRM just bewilder me. We can see from this very article why such DRM is necessary: without it, the labels would never have agreed to go along with this new form of media AT ALL, and even today would be stubbornly holding out while we all built up digital music libraries from whatever badly-labeled and badly-ripped stuff we were ever able to find on P2P networks.

DRM is necessary for this to be a "market", instead of an underground illicit trade. Sure, there are those who would prefer the latter for ideological reasons. But give me an easily findable, good-sounding, well-labeled single track for 99 cents and stamp me with the SELL-OUT label, if that makes you feel better. We'll both be happy.

And Stephen, it's probably worth an update in the body of the post, to correct the (media-fueled?) misconception that Mr. Lion already pointed out: there is no restriction on the number of times you can burn any given track to CD. None. What you are restricted from doing is burning a single unaltered playlist to more than seven CDs (e.g. as you would do if you were a pirate who bought an album from the iTMS, put it into a playlist, and then burned a whole bunch of bootleg CDs to sell in a back alley). Surely even the most grim naysayer can understand why that's a good idea. But if you insist, you can always just delete and re-create the playlist and burn seven more copies. It's a speed-bump in the way of mass duplication, and it's "soft barriers" like that that are at the heart of iTunes' bid for dominance in users' hearts and minds: it slows down the bad guys (while not really stopping the really determined ones, but that's good enough), and it doesn't get in the way of people playing by the rules.

Oh, and Jobs fought to increase the number of computers you can register to play your purchased music on (from 5 to 7), as part of the bargain with the labels that reduced the number of unaltered playlists you could burn from 10 to 7. The labels wanted that number reduced still more, but Jobs held out for customers' rights, just as he's continuing to do in this article; he won an increase in the convenience of a feature people need and use every day (number of registered computers), while giving up something that people really aren't ever going to care about unless they're pirates (burning 7 instead of 10 copies of a playlist). Gives customers more functionality, placates the labels, and (perhaps) thwarts pirates a little more.

I fail to see how we could have done any better than Apple "winning the market".

Excuse me-- the number of registered computers was raised from 3 to 5, not 5 to 7.

Agreed. Well said.

Just don't tell my wife about this. She's still pining for the old Napster. If she hears about this, she'll insist on upgrading to cable and signing on just to capture all those singles she remembers from the '70s and '80s.

I guess I need an iPod - the problem is that I'll need two.

Stephen, how do you and your wife manage to share one?

Forget Apple, try emusic.com. Best and cheapest legal music store on the net.Songs cost around 25 cents with unlimited use. Huge catalog of independent labels.As I recall you are a Steely Dan fan, well I believe they have their very first album which was a soundtrack for some crappy movie. I've been a member for a couple of years and highly recommend them.You won't find much top 40 crap but if you are into eclectic music genres they are an absolute treasure vault.

Download a program called Soulseek. It's the most badass p2p music downloader ever, and once you figure out how to use it, you'll never go wanting again.

Will Allen writes (speaking about the record companies):
"These idiots don't grasp how the world is working in their favor"

In the short term it works in their favor, but in the long term it is their death knell. Imagine for a moment that iTMS becomes the dominant channel for music sales. Now, as I understand it, a band with no label can get its songs on iTMS for just a couple hundred bucks. At that point bands have got to start wondering what value a label is really providing. If iTMS is the dominant distribution channel anyhow, then being locked out of major retail chains doesn't seem like such a bad deal. You won't get much radio play, but podcasts are beginning to look like an attractive alternative means of getting publicity. Add it all together, and I think the recording industry really has to worry about their ability to attract new talent going forward. Admittedly, there are a lot of "if"s in that scenario, but I think it's at least plausible enough to keep the record execs pacing the floors at night.

Now, personally, I would be thrilled to see the large record labels go the way of the dinosaur, but it's probably a bit much to expect them to go willingly to their doom. So, they fight back the only way they can, by trying to drive the iTMS price up to make it less attractive to music buyers.

-rpl

Stephen...looked around the emusic site and found the Steely Dan album I referred to.It was a soundtrack for an early Richard Pryor movie called "You gotta walk it like you talk it" recorded 2 years before the birth of the band.Listed under Donald Fagen and Walter Becker in the sites' search function. The site has a 50 download free trial membership which might be worth it to you just to get the album. Unless, of course, you already have it.

Jeez, Doug, is this an extension of a hostility rooted in life-long thralldom to Wm. Gates, or what? I didn't know tin-foil could so effectively constrict cranial circulation.

I think you've missed his point--I also am using an older model Archos and great-sounding, high-bitrate MP3s that I rip myself (getting close to 20G worth). Not in thrall to Gates or Jobs. Because there's no DRM, the music goes easily where I want it--on my desktop in the study and on the PC in the living room hooked to the main stereo and on my laptop. The kids have even discovered and copied a bunch of my stuff across the wireless net--pretty surprising what I hear coming out of their rooms now. With DRM that all would have been impossible or difficult to accomplish.

I simply do not want marginal-sounding low-bitrate, DRM-encumbered music (in either Apple or Windows formats) for $12 an album. Much better are used CDs (that you actually own) for, half that (or less) ripped at a quality bit rates.

My 20gb iPod has on it about 3500 high-bitrate, non-DRM tracks I ripped off of my own (mostly used) CDs. I find 196kbs AAC encoding to work extremely well, though I could have used mp3, wav, Apple Lossless Encoding, or even AIFF (uncompressed). 196kbps AAC seems to have a much cleaner sound than 196bps mp3.

Granted that the 150 other tracks (the ones I downloaded from the iTunes Store) are only 128bps and are DRMed, but half of those were actually free.

And I got the new Garbage single the day it was released, BEFORE I went to work at 6am.

www.allofmp3.com

The best, cheapest, like .01 per MEGABYTE (no kidding!) non-DRM, Legal..at least until someone figures out how to make it illegal, music service there is..

Safe and secure..Russian owned (Mafia, I'm sure) Put 50.00 on account and download all day long. At various bitrates.

Really..It rocks!!

Ciao bella

Catman

The price will eventually go up, but I appreciate Mr. Jobs pointing out that at this point in time there is no need to do so - and having the clout to get the members of RIAA to listen.

However, I won't be using any of these services for the foreseeable future. Even my older siblings do not share my tastes, mostly (albeit not exclusively) for music written before I was born. Neither of the two sites mentioned so far in this thread carry Henry Mancini, let alone anything older. Well, OK, they do show the Gershwins, George and Ira. But not much else.

My 20gb iPod has on it about 3500 high-bitrate, non-DRM tracks I ripped off of my own (mostly used) CDs. I find 196kbs AAC encoding to work extremely well, though I could have used mp3, wav, Apple Lossless Encoding, or even AIFF (uncompressed). 196kbps AAC seems to have a much cleaner sound than 196bps mp3.

Of course, with AAC you're stuck buying iPods indefinitely (or re-ripping or re-encoding your entire music collection for any other player). I expect that, over the years, our family will go through various MP3 players, and I don't want to get locked into or out of particular brands by ripping in a proprietary format (AAC without DRM isn't strictly proprietary, but non-Apple players don't support it). Buying DRM'ed music is even worse, of course, because then you're really stuck (unless you burn and re-rip to strip the DRM and then the sound quality sucks even more).

By the way, with high-bitrate MP3, make sure you're using variable rather fixed bitrate encoding.

Or one can check CDs out of the public library, altho I understand that most communities do not have as good a selection at theirs that Milwaukee does.

Of course, with AAC you're stuck buying iPods indefinitely...

Oh no Bre'r Fox, don't throw me into that briar patch!

"Of course, with AAC you're stuck buying iPods indefinitely..."

Oh no Bre'r Fox, don't throw me into that briar patch!

And you are sure, 5 years from now, that Apple won't have lost its edge and grown complacent and won't be coasting on inertia -- counting on people to keep buying iPods because it would be too difficult to transition their whole iTunes music library to some other standard?

Firstly, I don't need the "latest and greatest" - my 9 yr old USR Pilot still works fine, I'm sure in 5 yrs my current iPod will still work fine. Plus I'll have my choice of cheap "vintage NRFB" ones from eBay.

If it still does what I need it to, there would have to be a damn compelling reason for me to change, but that's exactly why I prefer to buy the CDs; Just In Case. I haven't regretted any Apple purchase I've made in the last 17 years, but there's always a first time. Meanwhile I don't worry about it much.

Besides, in five years "compressed" music will probably be as obsolete as my old vinyl is today. Why wouldn't I want to reconvert?

No, my hostility to Ipod has nothing to do with Windows or Bill Gates.

But I *do* like the fact that my Archos just looks like any other disk drive. That greatly enhances the ease of use, because I don't need some proprietary software to manage content.

Love or hate windows, it is a "standard", and I prefer to have my MP3 player conform to that.

My real hostility to Apple is their involvement with makeing copy limitation more prevalent and the fact that their hardware is roughly double the cost of hardware with (for me) better features and ease of use.

That having been said, I recognize that Apple is winning this and the growth of after market applicaitons for the iProd will almost certainly force me to drink the koolaid sooner or later.

doug

Has anyone considered that maybe the parent company of one of the labels responsible wants the iTMS to die?

I got a 40GB Creative Nomad Xtra, it holds about half of my collection, which is plenty for portable use, and one of those little Radio Shack FM transmitters, which means I can take it in any vehicle and play it through the stereo system.

It is one of my great joys to sweep down a gravel backroad, beer in hand, player on randomize, and finish a (hed)PE song as Diana Krall takes over... next might be Public Enemy or Hank Williams Sr. It's always a surprise.

Also, previous poster, vinyl isn't obsolete. Just two months ago, I found a Mojo Nixon LP that isn't available on CD, bought it, took it home, and converted it into mp3 tracks. It now lives on my portable in all it's glory.